HD black screen -signal interference

[cameraman_1]

My problem is that on one tv the screen randomly goes black, apparently from an incompatibility between the stb and the tv. The tv is a mitsubishi ws65908 bought in 2001. I have had att and tv service out multiple times and everyone  agrees on the problem but no one can find a solution. I can turn the problem on and off by simply switching from 1080i to 4-3 or widescreen aspect ratio in the system settings. If HD is turned on even non HD channels have the problem. Some channels are virtually unwatchable such as HGTV, my wife's favorite channel, while others show intermittent problems. The most bizarre thing is that any commercial form Apple will cause the screen to immediately go black on any channel. When the commercial is over the picture comes back. Anyone have any ideas on this?

[Pip_2]

Don't know if this will help you or not, but have you tried RC's suggestion in this thread?

[randyl]

what does running at 720p do ???

 a thought

 randy

[cameraman_1]

The tv doesn't have hdmi nor 720p capability. I am using r/g/b video and opitcal audio connectors, which have been replaced several time with no change. The dvr works fine on a newer tv with hdmi and all stb's have the same problem on the mitsu tv. If I record a program in hd and play it back the interference shows up at the same point in the recording every time. If I switch off hd the recorded program plays with no interference. We have multiple gateways and dvr units. Truly a strange issue.

[pklemm]

I have noticed this any time the screen goes from a relatively dark screen to a bright screen.

When this happens I get about 0.5 to 1.0 second of blank screen. Even shows up in recorded

programs. Most noticeable when watch commercials and the image changes from one commercial

to the next.

Something with the compression algorithm is my suspicion.

I am running 1080i.

[Pip_2]

---

pklemm wrote:

I have noticed this any time the screen goes from a relatively dark screen to a bright screen.

When this happens I get about 0.5 to 1.0 second of blank screen. Even shows up in recorded

programs. Most noticeable when watch commercials and the image changes from one commercial

to the next.

Something with the compression algorithm is my suspicion.

I am running 1080i.

---

Component or HDMI?

[cojimero]

After toooooo many troubleshooting test the problem is when the stb is in any other set than NORMAL. Any other set like stretch bring the problem back. The technician and supervisor take notes about it. The problem is in the software of the Cisco boxes that do not accept 16:9 or wide screen in HD (1080i). My two cents.

[cameraman_1]

The problem does happen when there is a change in the video signal, but when it goes out it will stay off for 1/2 to 2 minutes at a time. Over the weekend I realized that if I hit the guide button when the screen is black the picture bewcomes clear in the background behind the guide and also the PIP is clear. If I exit to live tv the screen will go black again. Clearly there is a problem with the video signal being transmitted to this tv. It doesn't happen on any other tv and this dvr works fine with my newer tv.

[tallicazx6]

I am in Fond du Lac Wi. and I am having the same issues, I too have had techs out multiple times (every week for the last 7 weeks!) and no luck, I think the problem is not with any wiring, but with the programming or the hardware itself, I am fairly certain the techs will not be able to fix this, and so I will have to go back to Charter. I would HATE to go back to them, but I am not going to continue to pay for very sub-par service like this. I love the whole Uverse thing, but this TV issue is getting to be a REAL headache!!!!

[dannyt_1]

I think you solved your own problem. Your set does no accept 720p signal through component cables.

Any network feed in 720p will not work on your set. Stations do switch their signals someimes during shows which is why it doesn't happen all the time.

[tallicazx6]

Does anyone have these problems with a Motorola box? I have the Cisco boxes, and the main problem is on my Mitsubishi 65" RPTV.

[goot6936]

---

tallicazx6 wrote:
Does anyone have these problems with a Motorola box? I have the Cisco boxes, and the main problem is on my Mitsubishi 65" RPTV.

---

What cables are you using with your cisco boxes?  They seem to have a problem opposite their motorola counterparts.  That is, with Cisco (if the box has your symptoms) you want to use HDMI instead of component, whereas with motorola you never really want to use HDMI..  Has to do with a loss of sync between the cisco box and your tv..

You can also try switching from 1080i to 720p.  That seems to have a positive effect on things too..

Edit...btw, if the fixes suggested above do not work, then the only resolution would be an STB swap.  Wouldn't advise it yet though because cisco hasn't even started making stb's with this resolved yet.. 

Message Edited by goot6936 on 10-10-2008 04:07 PM

[tallicazx6]

I don't have a choice as to which cables to use, my TV doesn't have HDMI inputs, and I have had my Cisco DVR replaced, but that didn't help. I also don't have a choice on 1080i or 720p, my TV will only run in 1080i. I am wondering if there is any way to get a Motorola box to try, or if certain areas have to have certain boxes for whatever reason. Also do you guys think running cat 5 cable to the stb would be better than coax?

[goot6936]

---

tallicazx6 wrote:
I don't have a choice as to which cables to use, my TV doesn't have HDMI inputs, and I have had my Cisco DVR replaced, but that didn't help. I also don't have a choice on 1080i or 720p, my TV will only run in 1080i. I am wondering if there is any way to get a Motorola box to try, or if certain areas have to have certain boxes for whatever reason. Also do you guys think running cat 5 cable to the stb would be better than coax?

---

Ok, the reason the replacement cisco didn't help is because the problem is a hardware issue...not a software issue, with the stb.  That is why I mentioned not bothering to have anybody swap it out because it'll just waste your time.  Now once cisco starts shipping boxes that are "fixed" then it'll be ok to have that stb of yours swapped out.  No idea when that'll happen though.

As far as running CAT5 vs coax goes, you could call tech support and ask them to test your hpna and ethernet drops for errors..if they see any on the hpna side, then it might be worth considering switching to cat5.  If its zeroed out then it would be pointless.  Tallicaz, what brand and model# of television do you have?

Message Edited by goot6936 on 10-10-2008 06:19 PM

[tallicazx6]

I have a Mitsubishi WS-65857. From the sounds of it, I may have to wait for them to update the box with a fix. The only problem with that is that as far as I know it could be weeks, months, or even years before this problem gets addressed on that level. I really do like the Uverse service, but if I am left with an unknown amount of waiting time to fix this, I probably will have to go back to Charter until this gets resolved and I would HATE to go back to Charter. That is why I have been doing everything I can to get this fixed. The techs they have sent out have been very helpful, but I think this is a problem that goes beyond thier abilities. By the way, thank you for the help you guys have been giving me too, I really appreciate it!!

[goot6936]

It's certainly not going to be a matter of years...realistically it will probably take a few months.  Give ATT a call in January and ask them about swapping out that box then...that should be enough time I think. 

[Escapee]

I agree with goot about waiting for a fix but on the other side if it is costing AT&T money for a fix that does not work they will push Cisco and Moto harder for a real solution. In most areas they have one brand stb or the other so they will not be able to swap. There was a post that techs were knocking on doors to swap customers moto for cisco. I can not remember the city if it was even mentioned in the post.

[goot6936]

*apolegies to be over-involved in this thread...I'll try to be brief with this one*

The reason that the cisco boxes were deployed on a limited basis is because this is the way a field test is done.  It's scaled up.  If all goes well (and obviously it didn't...), then they might have considered deploying the cisco's to their other markets as well (depending on what the contract with moto says on that anyways). 

I'm guessing that unless Cisco fixes this, and fixes it fast, its boxes might not make it out of this phase of testing.  I wonder if motorola ever "fixed" the hdmi issue with their boxes...

[tallicazx6]

I don't think I am going to wait until January with an unwatchable service in the mean time. The tech thinks it is a problem with the lines from the Vrad to the house on the poles somewhere, I disagree, I think what you guys are saying is correct. So it looks like I will be pulling the plug on this system, maybe I'll try it again in spring or summer of next year, but they seem to have a ways to go with this technology to make it stable and functional for everyone. Like I said, I really HATE to have to go back to Charter, but I don't see any real alternative at this point.

[goot6936]

And you couldn't just switch to red/white/yellow cables to tide you over until this is resolved?  I would hate for you to get yourself locked into a contract with something that you don't even really like =/

[Computer-Joe ACE - Guru]

The one thing I see here is, that something is being overlooked. All DVR/STBs on that TV, Problem. All DVR/STBs on any other TV, NO Problem. At least 2 people with same problem and Mitsubishi TVs. Is it possible that the problem lies with the TVs and not the UV equipment? Do the Mitsubishi's need a firmware update? Just a thought.

As far as I know the MOTO and CISCO boxes are identical albeit with some fixes.

MOTO = relabled Scientific Atlanta

CISCO = relabeled Scientific Atlanta which is now a susidiary of CISCO

The only difference I see is that AT&T cut out the midleman, Motorola.

[tallicazx6]

I agree that it looks like the Mits. TVs may be to blame, but it worked great with cable HD, so what's the difference? Is the signal that different from cable that it could cause problems like this, or am I overlooking something? It doesn't have to be HDMI to work does it? I didn't buy this TV to watch standard def. Is there a way to update my TV if that is the problem?

[Computer-Joe ACE - Guru]

Some TVs allow for firmware upgrades by the consumer. I think they would have to have either a usb or some other input port that you could attach a data source to, like a fire wire port or memory card slot. Otherwise, it's off to the repair shop.

[tallicazx6]

the thing is, if it works without a problem with cable, but has issues with Uverse, then to me it seems like Uverse is at fault.

[Computer-Joe ACE - Guru]

Ok, I went back through all my notes I have about my problems and service calls. The post about the menu bringing back the picture jogged my memory. I have a 42" AKAI LCD TV (no tuner) that has 2 composit, 2 S-Video, 2 componant, 1 HDMI, and 1 VGA inputs. The first HD service I had (DISH) I used one of the componant inputs. I also had a (non-HDMI) DVD player connected to the other component input. Perfect picture (or picture perfect as the case may be). Along comes UV, which I also connected with component on recommendation of the installer (even back in March 08 they knew of the HDMI problem). I am now on my 8th DVR.

Back when they put number 6 in, is when this (current thread) problem showed up. My blackouts did appear to be totally random, though punching up the guide or menu brought the picture back every time. It also happened in spurts or flashes (in out in out). DVR number seven shows up and they say HDMI is fixed and swap to the HDMI cable (AT&T supplied). That solved the video problem but created terrible audio sync issues (like watching old kung-fu movies with dubbed english). DVR number 8, they say HDMI is not fixed and they go back to component cables which again creates the video drop issue. Then after a lot of head scratching and three calls to home base the tech finally says the component input on my TV is "broken". I said, "WHAT!?" I tried swapping my DVD to that input and it did in fact display the same problem. Now I'm pissed because I have had to tell ( as politely as possible and resisting the urge to go over a smack them upside the head) all the many techs, to turn off the TV before swapping cables (which is something they apparently do not train them to do) and they would turn around and hot swap them again 10 minutes later. Some also have the nasty habit of grabbing the components cables about 6 inches from the connectors and yanking all 3 out at the same time. I said I want to talk to somebody of authority so the tech made a call, chatted a bit, and then handed me the phone. I explained that my TV worked fine (all inputs) before the UV techs started swapping cables and now I have only one component input (which has to be used by my DVD) and now only one option for HD from UV and that was through the screwed up UV HDMI.  The woman on the other end apoligized for the damage to my TV and told me that most of the HDMI issues were caused by the crappy cable AT&T hands out and she would credit my bill $40 (spent $33) for the purchase of a "quality" HDMI cable (which did in fact solve all but some minor, occaisional audio sync issues).  She then gave me a claim number and transfered me to the insurance department who then (quite promptly I might add) sent me a check for $700 (half the replacement value for my 18 month old TV).

[RCSMG ACE - Master]

Wow Joe.

[goot6936]

What is a "quality" HDMI cable?  I thought that the general consensus was that a cheap HDMI cable performed as well as an expensive one..

[Computer-Joe ACE - Guru]

That was their terminology, so I would assume that whatever cable they give out at install is not a "quality" cable.

My opinion is (and I'm sure plenty will disagree with me) you get what you pay for. There are the questionable quality under $10 cables, then there are confidence inspiring quality $25-$35 cable and then there are the freakishly overpriced and overbuilt cables like Monster cables at $50-$100 minimum. Plus, if price doe not matter, why didn't they just give $10 credit and tell me to go online and buy some cheap cable.

[SomeJoe7777 ACE - Geek]

---

Computer-Joe wrote:

That was their terminology, so I would assume that whatever cable they give out at install is not a "quality" cable.

My opinion is (and I'm sure plenty will disagree with me) you get what you pay for. There are the questionable quality under $10 cables, then there are confidence inspiring quality $25-$35 cable and then there are the freakishly overpriced and overbuilt cables like Monster cables at $50-$100 minimum. Plus, if price doe not matter, why didn't they just give $10 credit and tell me to go online and buy some cheap cable.

---

You do get what you pay for in a sense, but sometimes there are some greedy people in the distribution chain. 

For an HDMI cable, what matters in terms of whether it works or not is how well it can pass the high-frequency digital signal.  There is a certification body that certifies cables, and if the cable passes the certification, then it's just as good as any other cable that passes the certification as far as carrying the signal.  Now, there may be more things that goes into a cable's price, such as tougher insulation or armoring for in-wall installation, higher gauge wire for longer runs, etc.

But for the user who needs a basic 6' HDMI cable to connect 2 components in the entertainment center, you cannot beat the $4.19 cable from Monoprice.com.  This is an HDMI 1.3a, certified category 2 cable.  This means it can carry every HDMI signal out there abolutely perfectly for its 6' of length.  For this particular application, there is no need to pay more.

If you don't believe me, believe the 247 people who rated this cable 5 stars.  It obviously works great.  And if you HAPPEN to get one that's bad out of the box -- throw it away and buy another one.  At $8.38, you're STILL an order of magnitude ahead of the people who bought the $79.99 Monster cable rip-off.

I would not be surprised if the cable provided by AT&T was not certified in any way, thus the substandard performance.

[skring_1]

Okay, for those of you having this problem I want to verify something. If you have DVR something that you KNOW will cause the blackout issue do this. Play the video and this time before the scene that causing the issue push the down button as if you are scanning the channels.

I have noticed that if I keep something up during the "explosion" or something bright, it from blacking out. This makes me believe that there is some sort of connection or transfer rate issue. Bright displays obviously take up more bandwidth to transfer. So my thoughts is that our connection sucks between our house and the freakin AT&T box located in the other neighborhood.

thoughts???